Airdate UK 4th of April

Welcome back Captain John

Wow!

I know, I was COMPLETELY spoiled and I still cried. It was tragic.

And there were so many great lines...and James Marsters rulz!!!

I was completely fooled by Johns bad boy attitude, and didn't see that he was being manipulated! I thought it was odd he told Jack to always remember he loved him, before shooting him!

But, manipulated or not, why couldn't he just have told Jack the truth from the start? Or was Grey watching him somehow? I wasn't clear on that. But if John wasn't being watched, then why blow up Cardiff? And why string Jack up off the floor? (That must have hurt )

Still... great ep!

Poor Jack, finding his brother, only to find his brother is a damaged and tortured soul that has totally twisted and lost all humanity - in his desire to hurt Jack

Poor Tosh!

Owen is finally dead then? I mean, can the dead die twice? Or is he still floating around, in a gazillion melted pieces? I shouldn't laugh... I was beginning to like Owen (more than I can say for Gwen!) and I'm sad to see him written out

John and Grey can manipulated the rift machine to travel through time. Why couldn't Jack do that? Or can he, but there are consequences for using the machine? (Destabilising the rift???)

I liked how John saved Jack by giving him the ring Nice touch!

Spook~ Yes, John said Gray was listening to him with the arm thing. If he didn't follow the plan or tried to warn Jack he'd blow them up. That was why John took them so far back in time. To get beyond the signal but Gray found them anyway.

I adored the "Hold me" comment after John had blown up the city

OK my concerns are these. Firstly, how many bodies are frozen in the Torchwood site there? They didn't KNOW they had a frozen Captain Jack set to open on that date??? And wouldn't Jack be major head-messed-up by being buried for several hundred years, dying and living and dying??? Wouldn't it have been kinder to just kill Gray? John was right, you can unfreeze him and make him OK.

I can't say I ever got to like Owen. I recognize the actor is good, but I just felt too manipulated in ever storyline with him, "we made you hate Owen, now you'll love him and then his death will count" Grrrr I think that only works when the writers don't realize they are going to kill a character before they redeem them.

Now Tosh dying hurt and she was so brave, holding Owen together never letting him know she was dying also She ALWAYS got the short end of the stick, her death was all about Owen I was so happy they tagged on the little message from her. That no matter what, she was glad Torchwood was in her life, it saved her.

Well, the door is certainly wide open for John to come back, if there is another season. I do wonder what exactly the time line was with Gray. Had Captain John JUST found Gray when he met up with Jack in Kiss Kiss Bang Bang? Had he not realize {as he said it took him a while to realize how damaged Gray was} at that point how bad off Gray was or was he already somewhat under Gray's influence at that point?

So now they are left with a blown up city??? Poor Cardiff

I missed that bit - but why not write it down then?? Grey could listen, but surely he couldn't see??

When the 2 Captains had the discussion about John being a walking time bomb, Jack said: 9th generation detonator, you're a walking time bomb ... (and John said) add to that a surveillance circuit monitoring my every word and action and he has me doing whatever he wants or....boom





Face it, John was REDEEMED!!!

Good point, Spook. I didn’t think about that.



Good points – and I agree 100% …. How cruel for Captain Jack that he finally reunites with his brother only to find out that he’s twisted and tormented. …Even if Grey is frozen and brought back, wouldn’t that only help for physical maladies, not emotional/mental ones? At least that’s how the “frozen and thawed when there’s a remedy available” mythologies usually work. The line about Grey’s mental state reminded me of what Spike said to Buffy when she comes back from the dead: “You came back bad.”

Berry, I agree, John was redeemed. …Maybe he’ll be back next season; there are currently 2 vacancies in the agency.

I’m glad I wasn’t spoiled. Owen’s and Tosh’s deaths came as a real surprise. …ITA, I really didn’t care about Owen very much, but Tosh … I really liked her. She never got the happiness she deserved. I’m hoping that Captain John will have something up his sleeve that might bring her back. I also liked her post-death video that the remaining Torchwood members watched; very touching.

Sci Fi had a Doctor Who/Torchwood mini-marathon today – 2 hours of DW and 3 hours of TW. Guess who had the TV going all am?

He was certainly redeemed for these actions. However, he's still a murdurous maniac - he thought nothing of killing people when he first appeared on the screens, and showed no remorse etc. (I'm thinking in Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang )

Hi, i'm new to Dr. Who and Torchwood.

Question, does anyone know if Captain John and Martha will be joining Torchwood?

There is stuff going about that Martha will replace Owen, but since I stay away from casting spoilers (or any type) I don't know. But it's very possible. I'm not sure about Captain John, realistically I can see James character coming back as a guest appearance, but as a regular...not so much. But who knows?